TRNW-2: 10R80 pump bolts

Steve Everett severett61 at gmail.com
Sat Feb 15 08:16:11 PST 2025 

  We do have a small local dealer that we get all the drums and
valvebodies from , they're good about keeping the commonly replaced items
in stock, I'll get the manager to check on kits,  I generally won't use
anything but BW on the friction,  and I ordered a Transtec paper and rubber
yesterday, which amazingly was actually cheaper than the other option

    Steve

On Sat, Feb 15, 2025 at 10:55 AM pat schulte <zzyzxpat at gmail.com> wrote:

> If you have a dealer close it might be something to look at, I buy
> everything from Ford. I have found especially with friction and steels, the
> aftermarket (Ray) usually are not the correct thickness many times, plus
> the OE prices are very competitive.
>
> On Sat, Feb 15, 2025 at 7:45 AM Steve Everett via trnw2 <trnw2 at trnw.net>
> wrote:
>
>>    The unit I tore down friday was a 2021 unit, and it has the external
>> torx bolts, with a rubber seal around the inside of the head,  similar to
>> 4L80e pump bolts,  this unit had a terrible converter shudder, which was
>> the main reason for pulling it,  around 100k,  trash can is worn but not
>> real bad, drum sleeve hasn't moved,  we're replacing both anyway with
>> updated parts, as well as a valvebody,
>>
>>     The reason I asked about the pump bolts originally is because I
>> remember when we first started seeing these units we were told "always
>> replace the pump bolts," but in looking closely at them I saw no reason for
>> that ? all the ones I've done have had the rubber seal around the inside of
>> the bolt head,   the ones that come in one of the aftermarket ktis simply
>> have a ring of silicone there, and once you tighten them down it destroys
>> and flattens that silicone ring,  ( discovered that on the first unit I
>> built when I didnt have a clutch hub all the way engaged in the clutches,
>> and had to tear the unit back down )
>>
>>     It seems there isn't a day goes by lately that I am not disappointed
>> in the quality of some of the replacement parts we either have to use , or
>> are supposed to use?  I'm seriously looking forward to retiring and then I
>> will pick and choose what I want to work on,
>>
>>     Steve
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 15, 2025 at 8:02 AM Dan Hogan via trnw2 <trnw2 at trnw.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> They changed these pump bolts at some point as the original installed
>>> and original replacements appeared to have a sealing patch on the bolt
>>> flange and now the bolts in the OE kit have actual rubber seals under the
>>> bolt head.  Ford also changed from 10 mm hex heads to an external torx plus
>>> heads (EP) shown below.
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Randy for the info and this makes better sense on the pump bolts
>>> here.
>>>
>>> The aluminum bolts used to hold the transfer case to the transmission
>>> must not be technically TTY as they have only one specified torque value.
>>> I was looking and appears there are another category of bolts for aluminum
>>> fasteners designated as one-time use (OTU) and we see this a lot of German
>>> suspensions.  These don't use a seal patch or have any locking compound on
>>> them, so I suppose the fastener permanently stretching much like a TTY
>>> fastener is the reason for the one time use.
>>>
>>>
>>> Chris,
>>>
>>> Identifix must have the original (old) manual for the 2018 as this is
>>> not the same description as I just finished an 18 this week.  I think your
>>> Alldata is showing the manual for a later model or a revised copy.
>>> Probably closer to 2023-2024 would be my guess.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Check to see if Alldata shows the revision date up in the right top
>>> corner of the document.  This is showing  8/21/19.
>>>
>>>
>>> Keeping us on our toes I guess...
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>>
>>> Dan Hogan
>>>
>>> Buster's Transmission Service
>>>
>>> https://busterstransmission.com
>>>
>>> 704.847.5321
>>> ------------------------------
>>> *From:* trnw2-bounces at trnw.net <trnw2-bounces at trnw.net> on behalf of
>>> Steve Everett via trnw2 <trnw2 at trnw.net>
>>> *Sent:* Friday, February 14, 2025 6:01 PM
>>> *To:* Randolph Wilson <Randolph.Wilson at transgo.com>; Technical
>>> Discussion Forum <trnw2 at trnw.net>
>>> *Subject:* Re: TRNW-2: 10R80 pump bolts
>>>
>>>   Thanks Randy !   good o know ,  oddly enough the seals on the Ford
>>> bolts remain in good shape after removing them , unlike the aftermarket
>>> ones where the sealer is flattened and destroyed after initial tightening,
>>>    I'll play close attention to the condition of the seals, but I intend on
>>> reusing the bolts, unless I can get new ones from Ford,  I do not like or
>>> trust the aftermarket ones
>>>
>>>   Steve
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 14, 2025 at 5:32 PM Randolph Wilson via trnw2 <
>>> trnw2 at trnw.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> There are many reasons a manufacturer will call for new bolts.  Most
>>> common is because of a special coating on the bolts. The coating can be a
>>> sealer, a locking agent, or an anti-corrosion lubricant (think magnesium
>>> cases). They can also be torque to yield. The one thing about TTY is they
>>> will always be protractor torqued. Not all protractor torqued bolts are
>>> TTY, but TTY will always be protractor torqued.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> In this case Ford calls for replacing them because of the sealer.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.transgo.com_&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=smOzNWPZu5-MBJg-0tkHhHoVW9xEBKdKWsMxBeFAJDZVJI6X79ZhQVJ_erT6I9aF&m=V0WPChPhqgQ5ukNS48lkrV9etP1qesMLG6qjl_UdEVOZJ-QLBQ96gD98wOcjzhiC&s=fzsRheYvTDi1SiozTvti63qG6x5_qCvpuwgeykLD-zs&e=>
>>>
>>> *Randy Wilson*
>>>
>>> *Technical Support Specialist*
>>>
>>> 2621 Merced Avenue El Monte, CA 91733 USA
>>> Office: 626.443-7451
>>>
>>> *Calibration | Innovation |Performance*
>>>
>>>
>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.facebook.com_TransGo-2D600961476956220&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=smOzNWPZu5-MBJg-0tkHhHoVW9xEBKdKWsMxBeFAJDZVJI6X79ZhQVJ_erT6I9aF&m=V0WPChPhqgQ5ukNS48lkrV9etP1qesMLG6qjl_UdEVOZJ-QLBQ96gD98wOcjzhiC&s=3P8PB-WnggNOB5VJh2BLZbcQh2kQwSl16OdWeJX4kxE&e=>
>>>  [image: 1475592640337_I]
>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.instagram.com_transgoshiftkit&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=smOzNWPZu5-MBJg-0tkHhHoVW9xEBKdKWsMxBeFAJDZVJI6X79ZhQVJ_erT6I9aF&m=V0WPChPhqgQ5ukNS48lkrV9etP1qesMLG6qjl_UdEVOZJ-QLBQ96gD98wOcjzhiC&s=CKyeC_VG14e54DpQHFhtiiFyCxoawV4DDj9IKhXEB3k&e=>
>>>  [image: 1475592655171_t]
>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_transgoshiftkit&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=smOzNWPZu5-MBJg-0tkHhHoVW9xEBKdKWsMxBeFAJDZVJI6X79ZhQVJ_erT6I9aF&m=V0WPChPhqgQ5ukNS48lkrV9etP1qesMLG6qjl_UdEVOZJ-QLBQ96gD98wOcjzhiC&s=ttNt-_lviBu6o9UU07My_bxr2SxgJTvW278a9VY0-Jk&e=>
>>>  [image: 1475592664972_Y]
>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.youtube.com_channel_UCg6v9MzFmq7g3fy7-2Dr9PGIg&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=smOzNWPZu5-MBJg-0tkHhHoVW9xEBKdKWsMxBeFAJDZVJI6X79ZhQVJ_erT6I9aF&m=V0WPChPhqgQ5ukNS48lkrV9etP1qesMLG6qjl_UdEVOZJ-QLBQ96gD98wOcjzhiC&s=UlaTS0FfXqreCaQOThPd19jxVtcUXk5T9AmZuj3SIb8&e=>
>>>  [image: 1475592672363_L]
>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.linkedin.com_company_transgo1_&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=smOzNWPZu5-MBJg-0tkHhHoVW9xEBKdKWsMxBeFAJDZVJI6X79ZhQVJ_erT6I9aF&m=V0WPChPhqgQ5ukNS48lkrV9etP1qesMLG6qjl_UdEVOZJ-QLBQ96gD98wOcjzhiC&s=nS9NjWlvB8-dPXafN_52iJvwn-Y30b0ZcqYL6kr06Ac&e=>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* trnw2-bounces at trnw.net <trnw2-bounces at trnw.net> *On Behalf Of *Dan
>>> Hogan via trnw2
>>> *Sent:* Friday, February 14, 2025 1:11 PM
>>> *To:* Technical Discussion Forum <trnw2 at trnw.net>
>>> *Subject:* Re: TRNW-2: 10R80 pump bolts
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Steve,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> These factory pump bolts appear to be TTY (torque to yield) and are one
>>> and done.  I suspect if you decided to re-use, using the factory torque
>>> spec likely will be too low as the bolts stretch once and deform.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I know the transfer case to transmission bolts are definitely TTY and
>>> the factory torque spec is very low.  I don't think shops are replacing as
>>> needed, but it's likely a bad idea.  There's nine of them so guess they
>>> cross their fingers, pray and blame later.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I wish makes would not use these type fasteners as it only introducing
>>> errors and mistakes in the aftermarket to already expensive and costly
>>> work.  Blame the eurotrash as they started this mess with TTY on likely
>>> unnecessary areas of vehicles.  Cheaper i guess.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dan Hogan
>>>
>>> Buster's Transmission Service
>>>
>>> https://busterstransmission.com
>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__busterstransmission.com&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=smOzNWPZu5-MBJg-0tkHhHoVW9xEBKdKWsMxBeFAJDZVJI6X79ZhQVJ_erT6I9aF&m=V0WPChPhqgQ5ukNS48lkrV9etP1qesMLG6qjl_UdEVOZJ-QLBQ96gD98wOcjzhiC&s=u_eDJJFc-DyruvUBRow-8RgGFf8DM1dgQUGnSF8cHM4&e=>
>>>
>>> 704.847.5321
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> *From:* trnw2-bounces at trnw.net <trnw2-bounces at trnw.net> on behalf of
>>> Steve Everett via trnw2 <trnw2 at trnw.net>
>>> *Sent:* Friday, February 14, 2025 10:55 AM
>>> *To:* Technical Discussion Forum <trnw2 at trnw.net>
>>> *Subject:* TRNW-2: 10R80 pump bolts
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> anyone had any issues with reusing the factory 10R80 pump bolts ?  I've
>>> reused them on a couple units with no problems, I've tried using the ones
>>> that come in Precision kits, but their seal is nothing but silicone, which
>>> smashes and destroys itself after initial tightening ,  looks cheesy to me,
>>> I trust the factory bolts over them,  as long as you don't over torque them
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>   Steve
>>> This message was sent from the TRNW Technical Discussion Forum (trnw2).
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>>> TRNW Inc., 2825 Walnut Terrace, Modesto, CA 95355
>>>
>>> This message was sent from the TRNW Technical Discussion Forum (trnw2).
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>>>
>> This message was sent from the TRNW Technical Discussion Forum (trnw2).
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>> If you don't want to receive these emails from TRNW in the future, please
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>> TRNW Inc., 2825 Walnut Terrace, Modesto, CA 95355
>
>
>
> --
> Pat Schulte
> AAMCO Transmissions
> Temecula, Ca.
>
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